Wobble Steering

I've recently noticed that when I turn in a low speed I feel a wobble in the steering handle. I also noticed if I release the handle bars during speeds 35mph or below the front wheel starts to wobble. Is this a common issue?

The handlesbars flapping when slowing happens on mine i think its just small wheels long wheelbase, as for the turn in wobble sometimes its just the tyres either under inflated or past its best ,but i dont know how many miles you have on the front..I changed mine and it cured the same sort of thing

I just brought from the dealer this morning and they noticed the wobble, but couldn't understand as to why? They checked the tire and saw no unusual or abnormal wear. The tires only have 3700 miles. I noticed someone on the Kawasaki forum having the same exact problem and someone mentioned that the steering head might need to be torqued. The dealer asked me to bring it back during the week so they could spend more time with it.
Appreciate your information. I will take it back to the dealer and suggest them to check the torgue and if no resolutio, than I will request that the tire be replaced. After all it could be the tire as you said. Thank you very much.

Also grab the front wheel and wobble it about to see if the bearings are good (no movement or clunking)mine has nearly 20000 on the clock so it probably wont be this but check just in case because mine wobbles in corners a bit changing them tomorrow

I stopped my wheel wobble by removing the top box. Adding heavier bar end weights should have the same effect.

Barney wrote:

I stopped my wheel wobble by removing the top box. Adding heavier bar end weights should have the same effect.

The heavier bar end weights will also change the way the SWing handles.

When I do a shalom test within the lane, the heavier bar end weights change it from a nimble quick steering to a slower response with more effort with a lot less vibration.

Hi there,

My S'wing was recently suffering from a wobble, so I did a little bit of research and have had it minimised with heavier bar end weights....

I had noticed after my wheels had been powder coated several months ago, and with a new rear tyre, that at 25-35mph I could feel a wee wobble through the handlebars. I had felt it before, but it was only just noticeable, and not a problem. However the scoot is to all intensive purposes fine, wheels balenced, correct tyre pressures, and even with that gloopy tyre sealant in, I could still feel this damn wobble.... Yet at any speed other than 25-35mph, I can take both hands off the handlebars no problems, even at 90mph, (though I don't keep my hands off for long at that speed!). I do however have odd tyres, a michelin pilot sport on the front, and a bridgestone hoop on the back. For me the wobble monster seemed to start around the time that I had the new rear fitted.... Weird I know, as I wouldn't have thought changing the rear would make that much difference... However perhaps the different tyres sufficiently changed the dynamics of the wheels working together to make the tendency to wobble more apparent.... If you read on it'll make more sense.

A Problem for me is that I do a lot of town work and so do ride at 25-35mph, and it was well, getting to me. Plus my yamaha diversion bike has no noticeable wobble at any speed, so this exacerbated the whole thing for me. Anyway, having researched this issue of "wobble" it is apparently a natural occurance in that all bikes and scoots, being essentially an engine sat between two big gyroscopes, spinning in the same plane, but one behind the other, and joined through a frame, one of which is fixed, the other hinged freely to move out of that plane. On top of this all the while both gyroscopes/wheels are holding up the whole machine with you on top and at the same time soaking up bumps in the road..... well hell there is gonna be a noticeable wobble in the front handlebars at a certain speed... Each machine has its own foibles, some worse than others.... Faster sportier lighter bikes tend to suffer at higher speeds, and slower heavier machines at lower speeds.

Bar ends help eliminate the wobble, especially heavier ones. The stock ones on my scoot were I noted heavier than all the bike ones I could find, until Dave my friendly local and often seemingly magical mechanic produced these weird looking long ones that fit well inside the bars, and were much heavier than the stock S'wing ones, but it meant drilling out the bars a bit so they could fit..... I'm not sure what exactly type they are, though I know they were from a sports twin bike that was notorious for bad vibes through the handlebars and that these weights did a good job stopping the vibes.

To cut a long story short what should have been a simply 15 minute job was nearly 2 hours as the S'wing bars are seemingly not that hollow, only a little bit at the ends... Plus the stuff they are filled with eat drill bits.....! They were using portable drills as their big mains drill was being used off site for another job...... Anyway once they drilled far enough the bar ends fitted fine.

As to the wobble monster versus the heavier bars end, the wobble is all but gone, there is still a faint hint if you take one hand off the bars, and take both hands off there will be trouble after a few seconds at the critical 25-35mph. However it is now much improved at this speed, and non existant at all other speeds, and my S'wing is now back to the usual slick laid back adventure that I expect even if it is a wee trip to the supermarket for the shopping!!

On a final note, I've found the michelin front and bridgestone rear an excellent combination (apart form the now fixed wobble, if indeed that is what caused it) and handling is much sharper and quicker that with a full set of michelins, or indeed a full set of bridgestones which was frankly the worst set up of the three.

As to the heavier bar ends affecting the handling, so far so good, the handling has been as good as it always has, so no change there. My S'wing does have hyperpro progressive front springs mind.

Anyway I hope this email helps or at least gives you food for thought.

Happy Riding!!

I recently had the front wheel bearings changed. The old ones were OK, but there was a bit of play and i wondered if it makes the 25-35mph wobble worse....

Well the wobble is again much improved after the new bearings fitted. It is still faintly noticable but not so that it is annoying, and so to conclude, IMHO yes changing the wheel bearings (my wing is an 03 with 27k miles on the clock) does help.

I can testify that a spanking new '08 will have the "no hands" wobble at about 35 mph, so it's apparently normal. I've read that if you can actually feel the wobble with your hands on the grips then something needs fixing.

My wobble story:

I have an 03 Swing that was purchased new in 05. I've ridden it for four years without noticing the wobble. After putting on a new set of tires, a pronounced wobble appeared. Like what I read above, this wobble appears when coasting down from 40-30 either with no hands or with light hands (much more common). I took it back to the dealer (since I can only change a plug) and they said the bearings were bad. So after replacing the bearings, I rode it yesterday and the wobble was even worse! They're going to replace the new front tire with another one, assuming that it's the bad one. I've read all the above, but it seems that different solutions are working for different people. Any additional suggestions?

Tim

My experience was that I never had a wobble with "no-hands", coasting from 55 all the way down to idle, in the 4 years I'd been riding my 02. But then all of a sudden last year it happened, as soon as I let go of the bars within 5 seconds it would shake and wobble terribly. I had a new set of tires purchased but not yet installed. I took it to the local shop to ask about the wobble and whether I needed new bearings or something else. Some crotch rocket guys were there and asked me if I had old tires on it, and I told them yes but that I had new tires at home ready to install. They told me that once I installed the new tires the "no-hands" wobble would disappear, guaranteed. So I made an appointment right there to get the tires mounted and installed. Sure enough, the next ride was back to the normal no wobble. I know this won't help anyone with a brand new bike, but it may help someone like me that rides an older one and is worried that somethinghas gone to heck with it suddenly.

That's odd, since my experience was the opposite. I had 7,700 miles on the tires and they were nearly bald. When I replaced with new tires, THAT'S when the wobble began. I was told the bearings were bad and that the new tires showed up the bad bearings. So I got the bearings replaced and the wobble got worse.

What kind of tires did you put on?

Tim

Stockers, the Bridgestone Hoops.

I did not pay much attention to this topic, but recalled it on the way into work this am and so tried several times to test my wifes bike. No wobble at all on hers from 55 to about 20 mph. We have Bridgestone Hoops on the bike, front tire has about 1,000 miles on it and rear has about 2,500. I've never noticed any wobble on mine, but will probably check this weekend.

My bet is that the tires are the culprit or that the balance of the tires is not correct. Tricky business getting the balance right.

jdeereanton wrote:

I did not pay much attention to this topic, but recalled it on the way into work this am and so tried several times to test my wifes bike. No wobble at all on hers from 55 to about 20 mph. We have Bridgestone Hoops on the bike, front tire has about 1,000 miles on it and rear has about 2,500. I've never noticed any wobble on mine, but will probably check this weekend.

My bet is that the tires are the culprit or that the balance of the tires is not correct. Tricky business getting the balance right.

Dale...... I think you are right.... I mean judging from your avatar, you must ride hard, and you sure demand a lot from your tyres.... I reckon they are a bit on the worn side, hence the er, wobble?!

:ROTF:

Sorry, couldn't resist...!

On a final note, I recently changed the tyres on my Yamaha 900 Diversion...... And guess what... I now have a wobble at much the same speed as the S'wing, though no problem unless you let go of the handlebars, or if you just have one hand on the bars you notice it a bit more...... The tyres are properly balenced, tyre pressure OK, and the handling of the bike is now super improved to what it used to be.... A mere gentle pressure on the handlebars initiates a lean and it seems with far less "turning" or "steering" effect of the handlebars to get around those corners. It's like riding on rubber marbles rather than tyres.....! I reckon that the wobble is due to the fact that with new tyres with a full curved profile (and quite a flat one at that) as opposed to a worn tyre's squared off one have more room to allow the wheel to oscillate at that critical speed.

The tyres are by Maxxis and a fair bit cheaper than the competition..... £125 for a pair. (17 inch VR rated) That is a good £20 to £80 cheaper than any of the other top brands (Pirelli, Bridgestone, Metzeler, Dunlop, Michelin etc) They are superb! It's like riding a different bike...... Will have to see if they make them to fit my S'wing when my Michelin front and bridgestone rear wear out....

Bernardo,

That particular tire was on the rear of my SilverWing and surprisingly did not give any indication of failure right up until it came apart. Kim noticed a little bit of a ride change out of hers and we stopped before hers came apart.

Read the saga here: https://www.silverwing600.com/safety-section-f11/dunlop-scootline-sx01-tires-t48.htm

Now for a photo of the front tires that developed the same problem:



I did notice a wobble out of these guys.

Read it here: https://www.silverwing600.com/safety-section-f11/dunlop-scootline-sx01-tires-pt-ii-t404.htm

Both bikes now have Bridgestone Hoops on them and I have noticed no "wobble" similar to what others have described in this thread.

Woah... That must have been one wobble.....! But best of all is reading about how everything turned out OK and no-one hurt..... It goes to show that it pays to be careful about ones tyres and check them frequently. Thanks for sending in the pictures...

I have put new Hyper Pro progressive springs in the front end and new
tires and it still has not cured the problem. The dealer in
Mechanicsburg Pa. says that they can't do anymore about it and I have
now contacted Honda HQ's. I am going to have another dealer look
at it and then Honda can decide what they want to do. I will keep you
filled in.

Thank you! I'm just about ready to contact Honda myself. I'm waiting on new Michelin tires to try and then see about it. I don't even want to ride the bike anymore - it's gotten so bad. Thank you!

Dale,

That is sure some defect. I'm glad no one was injured at all. What kind of tires are you going to use now. I use the Pirelli Diablo and really like them. This is my second set after the stock Hoops. Good luck.

Jeff,

We have Hoops on them now front and rear. I have always been satisfied with the Hoops and the only reason we used the Dunlops was availability. At the time we installed them we just could not get hoops at all.

Bernardo wrote:

Hi there,

My S'wing was recently suffering from a wobble, so I did a little bit of research and have had it minimised with heavier bar end weights....

I had noticed after my wheels had been powder coated several months ago, and with a new rear tyre, that at 25-35mph I could feel a wee wobble through the handlebars. I had felt it before, but it was only just noticeable, and not a problem. However the scoot is to all intensive purposes fine, wheels balenced, correct tyre pressures, and even with that gloopy tyre sealant in, I could still feel this damn wobble.... Yet at any speed other than 25-35mph, I can take both hands off the handlebars no problems, even at 90mph, (though I don't keep my hands off for long at that speed!). I do however have odd tyres, a michelin pilot sport on the front, and a bridgestone hoop on the back.

I know all about that !@#$%^&* wobble and I've got some bad news for you. If your SilverWing has over 75,000 miles or 120,000 kilometers on it there is going to be some wobble between 25 mph and 35 mph or 40 kph and 55 kph no matter what!

Hi Pete,

Bearings....after that many miles. It would be a good thing to look into. Do you have a shop manual to read? Also check your brake rotors to be sure they are not warped.

DennisB

If you're Silver Wing is over 2 years old and no matter what you do it still has a persistent wobble at 25-35 mph then the teeth in your rear wheel that hold the rear wheel to the drive spline are rusted out. When you bolt a rear wheel with rusted out teeth to your Silver Wing the wheel will bolt on lopsided and cause a wobble at 25-35 mph. The naked eye can not tell the difference so if you suspect that your rear wheel is bolted on lopsided then put your Silver Wing on the center stand stand then rev it up. If the rear wheel bounces up and down at high speeds then that means that it is bolted on lopsided and it is the sole cause of your wobble. The only thing you can do buy a new rear wheel for $418. Before you spend that much money mosey on over to the Honda place and ask them to inspect your rear wheel teeth to see if they are rotted out and untrue. If they are rusted out then your rear wheel will always bolt on lopsided now how much you try to bolt it on straight. Have the Honda place put a new rear wheel on to the drive spline and ask them to replace any bearings if needed. If you ever take the rear wheel of yourself then when you bolt it back on to the drive spline coat it with lots and lots of axle grease to help prevent rust in the future.

Hi Pete,

What a Bummer! Sounds like somewhere in the bikes history a pressure washer was used on the scooter and water got into places that it should not be. That happens all the time. Pressure washers should be avoided at all cost when cleaning the scooter.

The only wobble I have is me not the Swing, that may change as I am having new hoops installed. ya'll got me worried now! Maybe should have kept the old ones even with the cuts across the center of the tires.

the only time i had a problem with wobble was when i had my rear tire replaced while on a trip. i was in decatur ill. and noticed the rear tire needed replaced as i was heading back to georgia and rain was predicted.
i stopped at the local honda shop in decatur and purchased a new rear tire.
on the way back never felt anything thru illinois due to the crappy roads, but as soon as i got kentucky i felt the wobble. when i got home i called the dealership in decatur ill. and found out that they dont balance SCOOTER TIRES, lol, had the tire balanced in georgia where i bought it and it is fine. if you are ever in decatur ill. please avoid the honda dealership there for your own safety.

Jim, That sounds like some sound advice.

I balance my own tires on my GW and plan to on my SW. It's pretty simple to hand balance the tires. On the front tire you can do it by removing the brake caliper from the wheel so it can turn freely when the front of the bike is blocked up off the floor a bit. Just give it a spin, mark the top with chalk when it stops and do it a few more times. Stick a 1/4oz. weight to the middle of the area where the chalk marks cluster and spin again. Once you find the chalk marks ending up randomly around the tire it's in balance. I do the same with the rear wheel by making a U shaped balancing stand out of a couple 2X4s with notches in the upper ends. Sit the stand with the upper ends upward, sit the axles in the notches with the wheel clear of the wood uprights and balance the same way as you did the front wheel. This method is accurate enough that I have no vibration in my GW at 100+mph. You can usually get wheel weights from tire stores. I usually go to Les Schwab tire stores and ask if I can buy a few weights. If you only want half a dozen or so usually they'll give you a handful.

Bumping this as I think it pertains to my problem, possiby?

Pete H wrote: "If you're Silver Wing is over 2 years old and no matter what you do it still has a persistent wobble at 25-35 mph then the teeth in your rear wheel that hold the rear wheel to the drive spline are rusted out. When you bolt a rear wheel with rusted out teeth to your Silver Wing the wheel will bolt on lopsided and cause a wobble at 25-35 mph. The naked eye can not tell the difference so if you suspect that your rear wheel is bolted on lopsided then put your Silver Wing on the center stand stand then rev it up. If the rear wheel bounces up and down at high speeds then that means that it is bolted on lopsided and it is the sole cause of your wobble. The only thing you can do buy a new rear wheel for $418."
My wing has something, not quite like the wobble discussed by most on the coast-down with no hands. Mine is more evident at lower speeds, but still noticeable at higher speeds. It is not very fast, like a "shimmy", but slower, and feels more like the center of gravity of my scoot keeps shifting and I constantly have to correct for it, say every second, or second-and-a-half.
Could this problem with the rear wheel rust causing the wheel to not be bolted on straight be the culprit? Or does anyone else have any ideas?
(Remember, my scoot is rebuilt from a front end collision. Frame was bent straight back, and straightened back out, almost to original specs, but not quite. I was told by the seller that there was no sideways distortion.)
Thanks,
TxSwingrider64

OK. Finally got time to tear down the silverwing and replaced the bent steering stem and stem bearings. Installed the new hyperpro springs, while I was at it. Wow! My silverwing rides like new! No more wobble!

TxS'wingrider64 wrote:

OK. Finally got time to tear down the silverwing and replaced the bent steering stem and stem bearings. Installed the new hyperpro springs, while I was at it. Wow! My silverwing rides like new! No more wobble!

As we say in the UK;-

Result!

Doug: Sounds like a pretty big job. Can you amplify on what it entailed?

Not me Ted, twas the original poster who carried out the work.

Comes from reading too fast. How about it Swingrider64?

Ted,
I purchased my silverwing used a few months ago (cheap). It had been wrecked and rebuilt. When I first bought it, I thought the slight wobble I felt (mostly at lower speeds) was due to my not having ridden in about 20 years. Later found out that the steering stem had been bent back and attempted to be straightened. It still had some bend to it, and I noticed slack in the steering bearings. I attempted to tighten the bearings, but couldn't get all the slack out. Long story short, I ordered a new steering stem and bearings, and the hyperpro springs as well. (My front end felt soft and would bottom out on any serious bump or dip).
The job was fairly involved, as I had to remove the front cover (headlight section) as well as several other pieces of tupperware just to get to it. Then I removed the front wheel and front forks. Then the steering stem and bearings. Replaced in reverse order, and back on the road again!
I meant to take pictures, both for posting on the forum, and as an aid to my being able to reassemble correctly, but I left my camera at our apartment. Sorry!
Oh, one advantage of changing the steering stem out was that I could use the old one to clamp in my bench vice and then reinstall the fork tubes into the fork clamps to hold them still for me! (Think I'll keep that part around, in case I ever change my springs again!)
Thanks,
Tracy

happend to me had wheels ballanced tried different tyre presures not what you want when your on holiday in spain on mountain roads in the end i changed both tyres (bridgestone) it was different bike fantastic, old tyres front avon done about 1700 miles rear bridgestone on when i got it but lots of tread left.

You wobble because of the tires.
If you get a wobble with new tires ... you've got other problems

My last 2 cents

Mine felt the same when I bought it 2000 Miler 2010 model I phoned the dealer and insisted he replaced the front tyre he agreed and sent me a new Hoop I bought a rear one as well thinking id do the pair together

I fitted both that night and have not felt it since !!
for me it was cured with new tyres !!

Here is my personal tire experience :

If you have "older tires" don't jack with higher air pressure. Those are not long distance tires. The materials suck. So after your beat up the tire, when you increase the pressure you actually destroy the tire be stressing it's guts.

That is why the stupid HOOP creates the diamond pattern. If you lower the pressure just a little you may "delay" or eliminate this pattern forming.