safety riding SilverWing and aging

At 75, this year so far ridden 24-25,000 scooter miles and another 4-5,000 motorcycle miles (TU250), have Bsc Safety Degree, been at this 61 years. I ride everyday and in all weathers and always have since 1955.

Passing on recent experience: Many who buy maxi-scooter are old farts who never were really good on bikes and maybe think scooter is easy/easier....I find SilverWing/Burgman 400 in time become harder to ride and take away some 2 wheel skills! And you need to watch yourself..

1. Autoclutch----hurts fine slow speed control. Take can surprise!

2. Linked brakes can cause slow speed disaster---think feet up U turn on narrow road---topple. I much prefer foot rear brake as Helix or old Vespa.

3. SilverWing is heavy and top heavy loaded for trip, Givi box makes matters worse. SilverWing near 600 lbs, Burgman 400 maybe 150 lbs lighter. No provision for plastic protection in top over=BAD. My Daelim in Korea 360 degree heavy protection for plastic.

4. Feet forward/high handlebars/no tank to grip with knees or foot pegs to stand on, take away from bike control on maxi scooters.

My TMAX was much better in the handling dept,period.


Point: as experienced, rider who spent a lot of the summer riding scooter(maybe 20,000miles)- and not touching motorcycle, I found my skills sloppy/even cornering skills not up to par and sometimes almost freaking me out-----my case I have the luxury of spare bike, motorcycle. When I returned home----from AK, got my TU250 Suzuki out-----ride it/concentrate on real 2 wheel skills/enjoy it---try some challenging roads/.

Bottom Line: I find working on skills/some practice high speed braking/cornering, etc. On motorcycle really makes up for some of the problems associated with aging on 2 wheels---even if you have not taken a riding skills course, take one---you are bound to get something positive out of it.

Based on what I have said....What will my next scooter/bike be?? Maybe new(already had SR500 in 1979) SR400 Yamaha.... Scooter?I see nothing that interests me---I like Vespa, but no dealers/Italian parts service is scary. I plan to ride my Silver Wing to 40 or 50,000 miles-----TU 250 will be around quite awhile as it is easy to work on, great gas mileage, etc but lacks center stand---enjoyable basic bike.

Be Safe.

john grinsel wrote:

Many who buy maxi-scooter are old farts who never were really good on bikes

You speak for yourself pal!

I think you've insulted rather too many times, under the guise of passing on us your experience of "rubber band" riding.

If scooters are so inferior, why have you spent so many years riding them? As well as pondering which will be your next bike, perhaps you should also consider your membership of this forum.



The only useful part of your post is to advise everyone to take advanced training.

john grinsel wrote:

At 75, this year so far ridden 24-25,000 scooter miles and another 4-5,000 motorcycle miles (TU250), have Bsc Safety Degree, been at this 61 years.  I ride everyday and in all weathers and always have since 1955.

Passing on recent experience:  Many who buy maxi-scooter are old farts who never were really good on bikes and maybe think scooter is easy/easier....I find SilverWing/Burgman 400 in time become harder to ride and take away some 2 wheel skills!  And you need to watch yourself..

1.  Autoclutch----hurts fine slow speed control.  Take can surprise!

2. Linked brakes can cause slow speed disaster---think feet up U turn on narrow road---topple.  I much prefer foot rear brake as Helix or old Vespa.

3.  SilverWing is heavy and top heavy loaded for trip, Givi box makes matters worse. SilverWing near 600 lbs,  Burgman 400 maybe 150 lbs lighter.   No provision for plastic protection in top over=BAD.  My Daelim in Korea 360 degree heavy protection for plastic.

4.  Feet forward/high handlebars/no tank to grip with knees or foot pegs to stand on, take away from bike control on maxi scooters.

My TMAX was much better in the handling dept,period.


Point: as experienced,  rider who spent a lot of the summer riding scooter(maybe 20,000miles)- and not touching motorcycle, I found my skills sloppy/even cornering skills not up to par and sometimes almost freaking me out-----my case I have the luxury of spare bike, motorcycle.  When I returned home----from AK, got my TU250 Suzuki out-----ride it/concentrate on real 2 wheel skills/enjoy it---try some challenging roads/.  

Bottom Line:  I find working on skills/some practice high speed braking/cornering, etc. On motorcycle really makes up for some of the problems associated with aging on 2 wheels---even if you have not taken a riding skills course, take one---you are bound to get something positive out of it.  

Based on what I have said....What will my next scooter/bike be??  Maybe new(already had SR500 in 1979) SR400 Yamaha....  Scooter?I see nothing that interests me---I like Vespa, but no dealers/Italian parts service is scary.  I plan to ride my Silver Wing to 40 or 50,000 miles-----TU 250 will be around quite awhile as it is easy to work on, great gas mileage, etc but lacks center stand---enjoyable basic bike.

Be Safe.

Many of the old farts with little to no 2 wheel riding skills (let alone motorcycle riding skills) often get scooters because they ARE easier and less demanding to ride than motorcycles. I don't mean to sound sexist but smaller, young women (well, OK older ones too   ) riding Maxi-scooters instead of bigger, more complicated motorcycles should make that evident. (understand I'm not saying old farts are like teenage girls or old ladies... it's just that, uh... oh never mind. I think folks understand what I mean.)

1.) I do agree about autoclutching and really wish there was a way to manually operate it at low speeds. But, there are ways to deal with some of those issues as described in #2 below

2.) Linked brakes at low speeds really requires a different technique in the example given of a tight, low speed turn. Give it some braking while at the same time more throttle. That way there is power already on tap as you ease off the brakes and don't have to worry about clutching issues then as well..... I would have thought that highly experienced scooter riders might already know this technique.

3) More weight comes in larger size bikes. I'm pretty sure the Silverwing is not the only one considered to be top heavy. Almost any bike becomes top heavy with an added load. Really not many places to put stuff and a passenger but on top of the bike, so that should come as no wonder. (side panniers/saddle bags and some trailers being somewhat of an exception to some degree since they carry loads lower on the bike)

Bikes are not meant to be toppled over and so many manufacturers don't consider adding the extra complication and expense to most of their bikes. But some do provide that option or there are aftermarket suppliers that have parts for owners that want their bike with crash bars and such.

4.) The complaint there with differences between motorcycles & Maxi-scooters (and scooters in general) probably has more to do with a rider that is more familiar and accustomed to motorcycles. Generally speaking, scooters have a lower center of gravity, smaller wheels and shorter wheelbases that actually make them more maneuverable than their larger motorcycle counterparts. Scooters have floorboards that provide ways for the rider to shift their weight if needed for comfort AND control. Step through design is there for ease of operation and does not necessarily reduce the ability to control. Control, in the main is a rider issue. Each scooter and motorcycle is designed to OPERATE best within the parameters they were DESIGNED to operate in. But some do have larger operating envelopes than others and some are just better at it than others because they were designed and built that way. So, comparing scooters to motorcycles in many ways is like comparing apples to oranges.

Of course the T-Max was much better in the handling dept, it is a sportier scooter and was designed to operate in that manner and not like a little Vespa & others. Maxi-scooters shouldn't be lumped together with all 2 wheel bikes in that way. If one wants better performance from a bike, then they shouldn't expect their scooter to do better than it was designed to do and should get a better performing bike. Simple as that. Period.

Point: Not every scooter rider has much motorcycle experience and some none at all. So they might not even know (or care) what is being said in that regard. (this IS a scooter forum after all) So in some degree, motorcycle experience and comparison to scooter riding is irrelevant here. Fine for chest thumping, but of little use to those that ride scooters exclusively.

Bottom Line:  Working on skills/some practice high speed braking/cornering, etc. on WHATEVER TYPE of bikes one owns/operates can make up for some of the problems associated with aging on 2 wheels

And I would agree with this ---even if you have not taken a riding skills course, take one---you are bound to get something positive out of it.

Finis: Ride what you like and ride safe

addendum: The ideas here were presented in a way to point out the failings (IMO) of the original message without necessarily attacking the OP. I try to play nice...... mostly

Somebody must be feeling guilty.

john grinsel wrote:

Somebody must be feeling guilty.

Me? Not one bit

bandito2... a car tire heretic... and proud of it.

I think John's right in a way, there's a lot of older riders who turn to maxi scooters only when the physical weight of a big lardass tourer becomes too much, or dodgy knees, wrists, or hips make riding convential bikes painful or tiring.

You can read that in some of the posts on here and other maxi forums, also anyone who's been around maxi scooters for a few years wouldn't buy an early model thirsty Silver Wing, yet on here there's always another old boy buying a 10-12 years old as his first maxi. Then there's the regularly repeated topics about the starting procedure, how to pull it onto it's centre stand, and whether or not it's an ABS model.

These are all questions that get asked regularly by experienced older riders that are the majority on here. The same questions don't appear to be asked on UK forums where Auto Only Licences are popular and members are used to twist n' go scooters from their teens and twenties.

A lot of the bike riders that presently blank or don't return the wave from a scooter because "it's not a proper bike" are the maxi riders of the future.

I think it must be remembered that English is not John's first language ( he has many) and sometimes when things are said it is may not be exactly what is meant. Having had motorcycles since i was 16 yrs old and only had Scooters for 4/5 years, due to health problems i can no longer throw my leg over a motorcycle, I think he is just pointing out the different technique that is needed in controlling a motorcycle as opposed to a Scooter. Much the same as now I prefer an Automatic drive car, when some years ago i would never have switched from manual drive. Iam sure it is not John's intention to offend anyone.

john grinsel wrote:

Somebody must be feeling guilty.

If enjoying riding my scooter is a sin, then yes, I'm guilty.

If insulting others is a sin, then you are guilty.

Old Limey wrote:

 I think it must be remembered that English is not John's first language ( he has many) and sometimes when things are said it is may not be exactly what is meant. Having had motorcycles since i was 16 yrs old and only had Scooters for 4/5 years, due to health problems i can no longer throw my leg over a motorcycle, I think he is just pointing out the different technique that is needed in controlling a motorcycle as opposed to a Scooter. Much the same as now I prefer an Automatic drive car, when some years ago i would never have switched from manual drive. Iam sure it is not John's intention to offend anyone.

Yes, I'm similar in that I got bored with bikes after 22 years and the only maxi available back in 1996 was the Honda CN250 Helix. I passed my test in a manual car but also prefer Auto or Semi-Auto gearboxes. I'd probably have a problem throwing my leg over a motorcycle these days because I found it a problem when choosing a push bike recently.





You're been missing off here for a while old lad, I was quite worried about you.  

I went to scooters and then my CTX700 DCT just because I enjoy the automatic aspect of them.  I started riding motorcycles when I was about 14 and I went to scooters about 8 years ago.  Here in California we can split traffic so the auto is very convenient to filter through traffic.  I understand when John says it would be good to take a m/c riding safety course every once in awhile.  But I also see some people who only ride m/c's that are very poor riders.  

I do think it wouldn't do the USA any harm to have the system like Europe, that you can't have a m/c over so many hp, for the first couple of years.  Some here will go out and buy a crotch rocket with 150 hp or a big Harley or Gold Wing as a first bike.  I don't think that is very smart but it is their choice.  But my CTX700 DCT is very enjoyable to ride and I don't feel I am any worse a rider now than when I was changing gears. (it does have a manual to it but I don't use it much).

Old Limey wrote:

Iam sure it is not John's intention to offend anyone.

Now you'll just hurt Old Man Grinsel's feelings. He takes pride in being offensive.

I have read the original post several times to try to obtain my thoughts of the message. My conclusion, I don't necessarily see anything offensive or insulting, rather just the thoughts and opinion of an experienced rider. I enjoy reading this forum and do so on an almost daily basis and I would hate to see someone with John's experience leave.

We all have opinions which are shaped by our experiences which are not all the same. I've been riding since I got my scooter ticket at 14 that was 1956. I started out on a scooter, a real death trap, a 1949 Cushman scooter. Rear brake only, no brake light and a headlight that could be out shined by a candle. I've had a lot of bikes since then from a 50cc two stroke to a 1800cc Goldwing. Currently I ride a C650GT and a K1100LT. I prefer the maxi for errands and riding around town. My wife prefers riding the back of the scooter because she says it's more comfortable than the K bike. We ride two up in town and on the freeway on the thing. I like the motorcycle for fun in the twisties and just the fun of a bit of running through the gears in the mountains. There is a bit of difference in the techniques of handling the two bikes, I like both in their proper milieu. I don't think there was any insult meant by John.
One thing that's different between the UK and the US is licensing is very different. Most states here have abandoned the idea of issuing different ratings on bike licenses. Once size does all. Scooters 50cc and below don't require a motorcycle license. There are arguments about people starting out of high performance machines but I like it the way it is here. You should be responsible for your own self. I personally don't like the Government trying to be a babysitter. It's like flying ultralight aircraft. You don't need a license and you can teach yourself to fly. It might kill you but it's your responsibility. I like that. People should be treated like thinking adults. I sailed my 25' Pacific Seacraft off shore in the Gulf of Alaska and Pacific Ocean. I didn't have to have a license and I taught myself to sail and navigate with a sextant. That's the way it should be.

Maybe I'm younger than the average Silverwing demographic - so be it. (I think the Silverwing demographic isn't so much "old men" but rather "motorcycle riders who aren't trying to impress someone else" - sometimes that takes age, sometimes not). I learned long ago to not assume anything about anyone based on age. FWIW, my wife, not an "old man", also rides a Silverwing (it's handy having two essentially identical bikes - lots of advantages to that) and is every bit as good of a rider as I am, and probably better. I've met 25 year olds riding "real motorcycles" with $#@! riding skills - obviously if you don't practice, your skills will suck regardless of age. And all of us have things that are harder for us than for other people, so we need to be aware of our limitations.

Plenty of people are better riders than me. Plenty are worse too. I typically ride pretty aggressively, but have been impressed by a Harley or two that was ride with tremendous skills - riders I wouldn't even begin to try to keep up with. And I imagine some sport bike riders have felt the same about me (interestingly, I find slow sport bike riders are much more willing to help me get around them than slow harley riders are). Rider skill generally trumps bike type.

I'm in physical condition such that I could ride whatever I decided I wanted to ride. I know how to ride a "real" bike just fine, but chose a Silverwing for my daily bike because I think the handling is actually better than many bikes, certainly bikes that I feel comfortable on (I don't find sport bikes comfortable). Yes, it's definitely different handling. Of course a Harley is different than a 1000cc sport bike too. If I went back to a "real" bike, I'd need to practice before my skills on that bike were on-par with my skills currently on the wing. I find the cornering awesome on the Wing because I can focus on my line and speed, without tying up brain power trying to figure out what gear to be in. But I can see others that want that control over gear, which is fine too.

As for riding slow, the Silverwing does just fine. I can do figure 8's in my driveway all day long with turns-to-the-stops if I want. It's practice and technique. Like any bike. I've had no problem with U turns on narrow roads with the brakes - I find they do exactly what I expect every time. I always ride these U turns with slight rear brake (it doesn't take much, certainly not enough to cause the proportioning valve to activate front brakes). But if you find your braking is such that you are activating front brake at low speed turns, you probably should get something with ABS - might save you locking the front wheel (I've never had the ABS activate at low speed - but I have good control of my left hand so I can modulate the rear brake fine). Daily, I do a low speed to-the-stops U turn on my commute - never with a problem.

As for John's next bike, John you should go with something you feel comfortable with. You obviously feel the handling has compromises on a scooter - so you probably should look at something with handling that is more comfortable to you.

One thing I know: the stereotyping of riders by the OP isn't particularly helpful to make people safer.

You're been missing off here for a while old lad, I was quite worried about you.   [/quote] I've been looking in Meldrew, but not signing in. None of the recent topics interested me enough to comment.

If nothing much on here is of interest, you could go onto that other forum and say hello to JeffR in disguise.

In reading John's opening post on his thread, I also see nothing new that he hasn't pontificated many times before. I don't know the point of this thread, other than that he might be bored.

"Many who buy maxi-scooter are old farts who never were really good on bikes and maybe think scooter is easy/easier...."

I see no point to this statement. It is judgmental, and false. Its only purpose is to jab the dog with the stick.You have no empirical data for support; it's just another John Grinsel irrational opinion. I'm not going to edit anything here, but John, I'd really like you to re-read your first post and see what its purpose is. If you really think the sentence I quoted from you deserves to stay in your post, then leave it. Otherwise, I suggest you edit it out. And don't tell us you don't know how to edit a post.

Old farts do buy maxi scooters. It may be that big motorcycles have become more than they want to handle, it might be that they want the convenience. In the US it could be because they're finally secure in their manhood and can allow themselves to be seen riding a scooter without shame. Who knows? Who cares?

exavid wrote:

Old farts do buy maxi scooters.

Yes they do and I have no problem with that.
But John takes it a step further by generalizing that these same old farts were never any good on motorcycles anyways.

Not acceptable.

Well consider this, regardless of the intention of the original post there is one thing that this post has accomplished, it has gotten a lot of attention. Maybe sometimes we need a post like this to cause people to read all the comments just to see where it will lead. I know I have read them all with interest. I like to see something different at times and think it is good for the forum. I also appreciate the work the forum admins do. I know each of your are working hard to keep it all in line.

Meldrew wrote:

If nothing much on here is of interest, you could go onto that other forum and say hello to JeffR in disguise.

I just joined the maxi puppets forum. I find it hard to believe I haven't been there before but I guess I haven't been. It seems similar to this site but for all scooters.

I think John should join that forum to teach the English scooter riders how to ride.

Being just a kid here, your all old farts to me   .....

JeffR_ wrote:

I think John should join that forum to teach the English scooter riders how to ride.

And the British can teach Yanks correct English spelling, punctuation and grammar; eg the difference between your and you're.  

Wait a minute; we're talking about the Muppet forum.  Ignore the above!  

Wait another minute; you lasted all of 15 days and 11 posts on the Muppets forum back in November- December 2009. Some of your posts and the replies are still there to see. Not your kind of forum was it.

Meldrew, I see that you've edited your post since I started my reply. Perhaps you decided to make it less inflammatory!

Meldrew wrote:

you lasted all of 15 days and 11 posts on the Muppets forum back November- December 2009.

It seems MUCH longer ago. I was one of the early members of Muppets, but I don't recall you being there at the time.

Meldrew wrote:

They really didn't like your attitude there.

You originally said something about Muppets telling me to *&$@'# off.  Actually, I left of my own accord, having been disgusted by the foul language and juvenile nature of the posts.

Meldrew wrote:

Some of your posts and the replies are still there to see.

I've moved on and have no need to rake over the past just to find "ammunition" to use against others.  Do you have a database of such material? Many of your posts here and another place suggest so, as they frequently include negative comments about members and their previous posts.

Oh dear, there's a stalker among us!

I edit nearly all my posts here and on another couple of forums, I decided that one was more blunt than inflammatory and deleted what you'd call the foul language, that's my caring nature.

You weren't one of the early members of the Muppets, it started in it's original format back in 2006. I joined in early April 2009 after lurking for a while, went on a tour to Germany and came back to find a new format and had to join again.

You joined when there was a separate Burgman section formed that sort of evolved then broke away into the UK section of the Burgman Riders forum under the late Henry C, "Lovers of Fun" and all that nonsense.. I rode a 650 Burgman back then and was on the Members List he originally published, but I never posted anything on that forum because it was far too staid with no foul language or juvenile posts.

The first rule of any forum is you don't take any of the online stuff seriously or personally. I can't stand forum members who PM because you've posted something they don't agree with or like. In fact I had one from a member off here about 10 days ago, I recognised the name and deleted it unread.

Meldrew wrote:

You weren't one of the early members of the Muppets, it started in it's original format back in 2006.

Yes - 2006, which is when I joined! (I said I thought is was earlier than 2009). So I was there long before you. Ask its creator John Pardo, or Mike O who I think also joined then. We were then all members of the X9 forum.

At about the same time, the renowned Piaggio dealer John Thompson started yet another forum (TScoot), and someone else formed the Maxi Scooter Riders Club, both of which everybody also joined. In the end, there were just too many, on which the same members posted the same stuff. It all became rather repetitive.

As for the UK Burgman forum, I joined that because I met its founder at the Ace Cafe in London and he asked me to, having seen my Burgman 650 parked there. I agreed, because I thought it might have posts more relevant to UK riders than BUSA. Sadly, it had very little.

But that is all in the past.

What you still haven't explained is your persistence in dragging up your version of the past and trying to use it against others.



If you want me to leave this forum too I'd be happy to do so, as I'm sick of your bile.

C'mon guys, enough said.

Let's talk about bikes, not their riders, and that includes you, John.

Hmm interesting, I remember the X9 Owners Club starting up from a group that had bought X9’s from JT's, and I joined the Maxi Scooters Riders Club around 2007-8 because I wasn't really interested before. As you say that's in the past.

Exactly what version of the past am I bringing up and using against others? Who exactly do you mean?

OK bigbird you're right, so talking about bikes I was out on Sunday on my Dutch bike with one of those closed cell foam pad things stuck down the back of my shorts for the first time.

Meldrew wrote:

... I also suspect you're the reason tarmacburner2 and long time member Waspie no longer post on here.

I can't speak for Waspie, but am actually quite certain that his departure was not caused by a single personality.  

Hi Dale.

Back to the subject of bikes and not people, I absolutely love riding my F6B. For me, it's the best bike I've ever owned. It puts a grin on my face from ear to ear every time I ride it.

As an aside, the riding club I belong to in Winnipeg originally started with 10 members who owned Silverwings. Six of those members have since moved on/back to motorcycles. Those motorcycles include 2 Goldwings, 1 H-D ElectraGlide Classic Ultra (or something like that), 1 Kawasaki Nomad, 1 older BMW 1000cc air/oil head, and 1 Yamaha Stratoliner. All 10 of us still ride together.
And you know which 2 of those are the fastest and quietest of the bunch

Meldrew, I really don't know where you're getting your information from:
Colin joined MaxiMuppets at about the same time as me, following on from the spat on X9OC. JohnP and GingerPhil founded Muppets - I was member number 13. Then the whole system collapsed and we had to rejoin - Colin didn't. He'd already faded out as he was uncomfortable with the rather purile manner on there. In spite of a thorough search I can find no evidence that he ever made a post, let alone any post itself

The X9 Owners Club was not started up by a group who had bought their X9's from John Thompson. I came across Lawrence on the Net and, as I was thinking about buying an X9, asked if I could join his Newsgroup. OIn fact, I am certain Lawrence didn't buy his X9 from JT but I stand to be corrected on that.

Since you so clearly do not know all the facts I suggest very strongly that you desist. I was not going to say this in public but think it is as well that other members know so that they take what you say with a suitably large pinch of salt.

This thread is closed.

Reading the old forum conversations is a blast. With my very extensive motorcycle riding experience over 50 years. I would not buy the silver wing or scooter if I still wanted do a 1000 mile iron but ride (BMW would be called for); Riding fast in a straight line (VTX 1800); fit in with my buddies (Harley)

This Silver Wing handles very differently from any motorcycle I have ridden. I bought the Wing to enjoy the comfortable riding, reasonable speeds and be an old rebel.

Smaller wheels will not handle rough roads, corning the scooter requires planning and slowing down. All must remember form meets function. Scooters are strait line, smooth road vehicles not corning monsters or speed demons.

My advice, don't have a scooter for your first bike. The handling is inferior.

Murf wrote:

Smaller wheels will not handle rough roads, corning the scooter requires planning and slowing down.  All must remember form meets function.  Scooters are strait line, smooth road vehicles not corning monsters or speed demons.

My advice, don't have a scooter for your first bike.  The handling is inferior.

Hi Murf, thank you for giving us the benefit of your wisdom, based on absolutely zero experience of riding maxi scooters. Which in real world terms is nothing more than buying an old Silver Wing, joining this forum, and reading a load of mainly defunct topics.

Not everyone lives in a flat as a board Florida with super wide roads and highways going mainly in a straight line. Believe it or not there's Silver Wing owners on here that ride on roads that are narrow, have curves, bends, a variety of road surfaces good and bad, ride in wet weather or all year round, and manage to make rapid progress from A to B without worrying about the size of the wheels etc.

You're not the only one that used to ride motorcycles either, I suggest you learn to ride a maxi scooter competently yourself before patronising the rest of us.

I just say....coming from giant cruiser.....how do they handle?=not good unless you know nothing else.

WT...? You've been here for all of 5 posts, Mr Murf. First you want to "Freshen up" the forum, now you are going to pontificate on scooter riding. You, sir, are dangerously encroaching on Resident Curmudgeon territory.

As mentioned above, "learn to ride a maxi scooter competently before patronising the rest of us"

Tim

What a terribly jaundiced view of the capabilities of a scooter Mr.Murf has expressed. In March '16 and again in March '17, I did an Adelaide - Tasmania trip on a scooter. This included long distance highway transits cruising at the legal limits, (honest) some very twisty,bumpy roads and keeping up with, sometimes passing, large cruisers. Slowing down and planning a corner ? Except for nice open sweepers, wouldn't you do that anyway ! All in great comfort, good weather protection, under-seat storage and the ability to stretch out every now and again. I endorse Cosmic Jumpers previous comment re 'Learn to ride a Maxi competently.'* Of course the Wing handles differently to any motorbike he has ridden.............it's a scooter !!!

*[Edit] It wasn't my comment. It was Meldrew's

Motorcycle good. Scooter good. Both do the same thing in different ways. I was out on a friend's Goldwing today. It was pleasant to be back on one of the big road bikes once in awhile I get the urge to get another one but since there's no room on the garage for a behemoth and a scooter I'll keep the scooter. For town and local riding these things are a lot of fun. I've owned a B650, two Siverwings and now my BMW 5650GT. (sorry Meldrew, I mentioned it again) and found all of them fun, maneuverable, capable on the highways and byways. Not quite as good on the highways as a Goldwing but that's about all the big bike is built for. The scooters are a lot more versitile. I take mine on gravel and dirt roads where I wouldn't try to go with a 900lb bike.
I don't denigrate people who want a bike or those that prefer the maxi scooter or even a 50cc scooter. We all ride what we like and anyone who tries to tell you you're wrong is just ignorant.

exavid wrote:

Not quite as good on the highways as a Goldwing but that's about all the big bike is built for. The scooters are a lot more versitile. I take mine on gravel and dirt roads where I wouldn't try to go with a 900lb bike.

I would agree. The SWing is much more versatile For one person especially it will do anything you ask of it, slow speeds or traveling down the highway. Downside, Wife and I were out on a 2Up ride last weekend, I noticed she got fidgety and needed to move around a lot, needed a frequent break to stop and stretch.

The GWing is simply built for gobbling up pavement, which it has a huge appetite for. The first time I rode a GWing, I was amazed it had a feeling of just wanting to keep traveling down the road. A passenger will fall asleep and will endure long distances. Downside for 2UP riding especially, at slow speeds it's like riding a bull through a china shop. Very fatiguing.

Ride anything you like if you can handle it safely and with confidence. I saw a video of a really short guy on a big BMW all terrain bike. He could do anything on it, and dismounted with a jump off while maintaining control. There is also a video of a midget on a motorcycle in city traffic. He demonstrates great agility and control.
If you want to ride into your elder years, you have to make adjustments. I am still on my SWing and a VT1100Tourer. I feel comfortable on both; but I can see a Forza, perhaps in my future.

I like the step though, the under the seat storage and the kick a** power the Silverwing provides. I have already decided that the Silverwing will be my last motorcycle. I am not saying that I won't buy any more motorcycles. I am saying that I probably won't ever part with my Silverwing, unless I find one on the cheap that has ABS and then I would part with this one, minus all of my add ons, seat, windshield, top box, ram mounts...etc.

If I need to do a 600 mile day, I am on my Goldwing.

nice thread and topic... if ya can ignor the trolls.


as for the topic:: SIMPLE RULES

nobody cares about us on our scooters/motocycles. so dont expect respect those in there covered wagons to realize were are around.

if you are rideing like a normal person, there is only 2 things you cannot prevent. someone crossing the center line, or a 4 legged animal jumping from the hedge row. there is NO reaction time. everything else can be avoided. KEY rideing like a normal person and watching EVERYTHING in 360.

I did something today which has made me reflect on this topic. I hope you'll bear with me on this.

I was following a bike, (I think it was a 2014 Triumph 750 kind of size), through town and out onto my homebound road which I know well. As we approached my home village, doing about 60mph, something fell from this guy's bike, it looked like a rucksack, and I had to swerve to avoid it as it tumbled along the road towards me. It settled on the side of the road. He gave no indication that he had realised what just happened.

My instinctive affinity for other bikers led me to accelerate and draw up alongside him in his 2'o'clock position and look at him. His eyes suggested he was petrified, looking straight ahead. Meanwhile, I am on the wrong side of the road but I was checking for oncoming traffic. I shouted, "something fell off!" He glanced at me and nodded. I pulled in front of him and continued home into a 40mph zone.

At the time it seemed like a perfectly safe action but If the guy on the bike was a new generation of rider, i.e. an middle aged guy who has never ridden a bike before, and then goes and jumps onto a rather heavy and powerful bike along with little riding experience, then I probably scared the life out of him. Not to mention me being on the wrong side of the road; stupid move perhaps.

I can only imagine that if another bike had done the same to me, I would assume that he had reason for doing so and maybe slowed right down and maybe pull-in, just for safety's sake.

What is the a safe way to attract another biker's attention when he's in front of you? I'm worried that I'm becoming a presumptuous old git....gawd forbid....but life's for learning.

If I noticed any rider coming up close behind in my mirrors gesturing or flashing his lights, my first thought would be simple,  “**** off “. 

It's pretty normal to have another rider come up behind me, then make a big show of overtaking my scooter then ride along in front of me. I'll be thinking the rider will be overtaking the cars in front next, but usually they don't. The sole purpose of this usually pointless manoeuvre was to get past me. Simply  because most bikers have this weird mentality that any bike, scooter, or maxi scooter ahead of them has to to be overtaken. It's classic big bike, small penis stuff, it's the rules.

No doubt there'll be more of this next month when the April to September bikers come out in force and lockdown restrictions are eased. Whether they can still ride in their usual packs to purveyors of fried food, I've no idea.

I have cyclists overtaking me all the time when I'm out on my heavy slow Dutch pushbike, that's normal too, but there's none of the macho posturing of these leather clad bell ends with noisy exhausts.

Meldrew wrote:

If I noticed any rider coming up close behind in my mirrors gesturing or flashing his lights, my first thought would be simple,  “**** off “. 

“**** off” ? Really Uncle Meldrew? I’m surprised you’d feel that way. Who knew?

Yeah, took me by surprise too. I rather hope that this guy was grateful, despite me spooking him. I guess we both learned something about safe riding. Also, to make sure nothing will dangle or detach itself from our bikes while riding.

Why are you surprised Timothy? It's just a bit of harmless swearing, I've heard worse language watching some of our British comedians and comedy quiz shows on YouTube and I'm not the least bit offended.

Meldrew wrote:

If I noticed any rider coming up close behind in my mirrors gesturing or flashing his lights, my first thought would be simple,  “**** off “. 

It's pretty normal to have another rider come up behind me, then make a big show of overtaking my scooter then ride along in front of me. I'll be thinking the rider will be overtaking the cars in front next, but usually they don't. The sole purpose of this usually pointless manoeuvre was to get past me. Simply  because most bikers have this weird mentality that any bike, scooter, or maxi scooter ahead of them has to to be overtaken. It's classic big bike, small penis stuff, it's the rules.

No doubt there'll be more of this next month when the April to September bikers come out in force and lockdown restrictions are eased. Whether they can still ride in their usual packs to purveyors of fried food, I've no idea.

I have cyclists overtaking me all the time when I'm out on my heavy slow Dutch pushbike, that's normal too, but there's none of the macho posturing of these leather clad bell ends with noisy exhausts.

AHH But I love passing those leather clad noisy bikers and never seeing them again. Some can ride though usually 2-3 group and pushing it fun to hang with on a slow SW.