Dr P sliders, do I need them?

Looking back through the old posts there is a lot of info but I'm still unsure.
It seems that lighter sliders improve acceleration from 0mph, but do they make any difference in mid range acceleration?
If cruising at 50 or 60mph and I open the throttle to make a pass will lighter sliders be of any benefit?

Yes

If you must have more acceleration then lighter rollers/sliders is the answer. I believe OEM is 28g. If you like OEM performance then stay with Honda rollers or 28g sliders. But the lighter you go expect a decrease in top end and fuel economy...

Glen,
When I switched to 24g sliders from 28g rollers, I actually dropped 500 rpm at 65mph. I believe that the higher starting RPM uses more fuel but evens out with the drop in cruising rpm.

I've never felt the need to fit Dr Pulley sliders in six years of Silver Wing ownership, however tonight I had three Sloppy Joe sliders in challah buns in a bar in Downtown Dallas and they were well worth the money.  

Meldrew wrote:

I've never felt the need to fit Dr Pulley sliders in six years of Silver Wing ownership, however tonight I had three Sloppy Joe sliders in challah buns a bar in Downtown Dallas and they were well worth the money.  

Meldrew,
That's good for you! Not everyone feel the need for faster acceleration. I myself enjoy the G-force when needed and applied.

Hope the weather is more to your liking in Dallas!

Meldrew wrote:

I've never felt the need to fit Dr Pulley sliders in six years of Silver Wing ownership, however tonight I had three Sloppy Joe sliders in challah buns a bar in Downtown Dallas and they were well worth the money.  

Scary thought Meldrew but I agree with you! I changed to the Dr Pulley sliders at my first belt change due to info gained on this forum. My Honda OEM rollers had little or no wear on them so the change was not necessary. Especially as I did not change the weight (happy with stock performance). I could have got 2 belts to one set of rollers easily. That coupled with the price difference...Dr P units are more than twice as expensive as Honda rollers. For me I probably will not use sliders again but instead will go back to rollers. But who knows

I think it's a matter of choice. I fitted Dr Pulley sliders on my first Silverwing and noticed it improved performance. I have fitted Dr Pulley sliders when I did the belt change at 16,000mls on my current Silverwing.  There is not a "fantastic" change, but a noticeable one. If you don't want to spend the money then , I would say your not missing out to any great extent. There is a better response for overtaking that you would certainly notice with the sliders in place.

Sage Advice from an old rider, replace with upgrades when they fail and save your money for good friends and beer!!!!

FWIW after trying both 26 and 24 g sliders I settled in on running a "mixed bag" of four 24 g and four 26 g. The 26s were nice, great acceleration and a good rpm drop-off "at speed", the 24s offered only slightly better acceleration but pushed rpms slightly higher at 70+ mph.

For me the 24/26 combo provides a nice compromise...

I've wondered about the use of more than one weight slider. With all the same weight sliders there's an even force on all parts of the variator, with different weights there's different forces on various areas of the variator. I'm not saying it would cause problems but wonder if it might cause a different mode of vibration. I haven't heard of anyone having a problem mixing the slider weights, but wonder what the design engineers would think of it.

exavid wrote:

I've wondered about the use of more than one weight slider. With all the same weight sliders there's an even force on all parts of the variator, with different weights there's different forces on various areas of the variator. I'm not saying it would cause problems but wonder if it might cause a different mode of vibration. I haven't heard of anyone having a problem mixing the slider weights, but wonder what the design engineers would think of it.

They would tell you it doesn't make a rats's backside bit of difference as long as the masses of the weights are reasonably close (2 g is entirely "reasonably" close) and the total mass is evenly distributed within the variator assembly...

Best to keep the parts all the same weight, in balance. 2 grams at 7000 rpm can be a lot.Variator is bolted to engine crankshaft. Force is multiplied by spinning. Engines are balanced to a certain degree from factory. Racing engine are balanced as close to perfect as possible. Rods, crank, pistons and flywheel. Variator is the flywheel on this engine.

Installed 26G sliders I like them. Not much better 0-30 but after that feels quicker. Lower RPM's at higher speed.

It may or may not make much difference. If it doesn't well and good, if it does... not so good. But there will be a difference, because each roller or slider pries the variator closed as it moves out. The different weights may cause a slight warping of the variator since there will be a difference in the amount each roller moves due to centripetal force. I seriously think the Honda engineers would endorse the idea.

Thinking about but not sure, wouldn't the different weights act in a manner to wear one of the sets more than the other due to the weight difference and not applying equal force?

I did a search on the Dr P's website and found a .pdf file where they recommend either 24g. or 25g. sliders for the Silver Wing 600.

Therefore, it would appear they manufacture 25g. sliders and I may just purchase those... in time.

After riding only a few kms with Dr Pulleys in town because of the late spring arrival and some snowy days O´m quite impressed. I´ll head on a proper trip on friday. A straight answer to your question; no, you don´t need them necessarily, but I guess you might want them.

I would suggest a Corbin seat and a cup holder instead.

Probably better not to mention a cup holder on this forum....

I was just about to add the leather straps to the brake levers to the debate

Oh man, you're going to set him off for sure.

Well the Corbin seat will make your time on the seat more comfortable and a cup coffee in the cup holder will give you more smiles to the miles.  

Used Corbin seat:  $250
Cup holder               35
Starbucks coffee         3

Total costs:  $288  (I am not sure of the cost of the rollers but this would be money better well spent.) 

Your butt will feel better and your heart rate will go up, but the scooter performance will remain the same.

I apologize to the OP in taking this off topic of the economic opportunity costs of purchasing rollers.

Leena Hallasmaa wrote:

After riding only a few kms with Dr Pulleys in town because of the late spring arrival and some snowy days O´m quite impressed. I´ll head on a proper trip on friday. A straight answer to your question; no, you don´t need them necessarily, but I guess you might want them.

I agree 110%--no one "needs" them unless you are the sort that wants your machines to be "all that they can be" or at least headed in that direction. Many are complacent are comfortable living their live in "safe mode", many are not and like to experiment and seek their personal edge. I am of the latter group and have made "modification" mistakes, but hopefully have had more successes than mistakes, and if not have learned from those mistakes¹.

The various "weights" of sliders offered are among the many options available to let each of us find that edge.

So the bottom line answer to do you "need" them is not anything anyone else can answer--you have to decide...

---------------------------------------------
¹ - Thomas Edison was working to make a practical incandescent lamp, he had tried nearly 100 filament materials with no solution. A reporter asked if he was disappointed by his failures--Edison responded that he "...had no failures, he now knew 100 things that do not work."

And that is true genius...

Let's see... Moon hub caps, loud heel taps, glass packs, penny loafers, peelin' out, raised white lettered tires, lowered rear ends, california rakes, change the jets, advance the timing, put on some headers... you name it... it was really cool and fun back then to do whatever made you feel good about your vehicle. You have the bucks and want sliders to put in your variator to improve acceleration or to make it run smoother ???? Go ahead... and have a great time doing it too !!! You might like it and you might not... but it's still yours... Have fun !

The sliders make a big difference in the response of the scooter, the 26g sliders gave me a lower ratio off-idle and a higher ratio on the hiway.
The peak acceleration with stock was about 25% less then with the sliders.

About 2000mi ago I installed slightly stronger clutch springs and a stronger contra spring.
This gave me another 25%, and put my RPMs closer to the power band.

If you are a heavy rider, or ride 2-up with luggage, or just want better acceleration, these are mods that you should consider.
They are not expensive, they don't negatively effect reliability, and most importantly provide a tangible and measurable improvement in performance.

Hey, go for the gold, you only live once.

In keeping with my wont to dig up old topics, I'm thinking of replacing my Dr Pulley 28g rollers for Dr Pulley 28g sliders.

I'm not looking for better performance but in my head I'm thinking that the sliders seem to take up more space inside the ramp plate. I suspect that my ramp plate is worn...( my Doctor has recommended surgery but I declined!). I also suspect that my CVT is original and may have had a hard life despite only 33,000 miles on the clock.

Anyhow, I wonder if sliders may take up any play in the ramp plate. My current rollers are only about 10,000 miles old. Besides, I like the idea of sliders over rollers.

Am I deluded or could they make a difference?

I'm on my second wing and over 50 years of riding, just don't replace working parts. SW keeps up with the Harley Buddies but a little old to ride with the sports bike crowd. lol

You got money to burn and time to play with go for it.

Good grief, I started this how long ago?
25g slider went in and made for a much better ride. Improved fuel economy? Don't be silly. Reduced revs at speed? Nope. Reduction just NVH (noise vibration harshness)? Can't say I've noticed. But it does scamper up hills and past tractors with ease and that's all I wanted.

Loosemarbles wrote:

In keeping with my wont to dig up old topics, I'm thinking of replacing my Dr Pulley 28g rollers for Dr Pulley 28g sliders.

I'm not looking for better performance but in my head I'm thinking that the sliders seem to take up more space inside the ramp plate. I suspect that my ramp plate is worn...( my Doctor has recommended surgery but I declined!). I also suspect that my CVT is original and may have had a hard life despite only 33,000 miles on the clock.

Anyhow, I wonder if sliders may take up any play in the ramp plate. My current rollers are only about 10,000 miles old. Besides, I like the idea of sliders over rollers.

Am I deluded or could they make a difference?

If, if, you are considering changing variator weights then you might want to actually drop down a notch in weight. I’ve never heard of a ramp plate wearing. And I don’t think that Dr Pulley sliding weights would take up any of the wear if it did wear. However Dr Pulley Sliding Pieces will allow the ramp plate to seat firmly on the variator as well as take up the lateral wear slop between the variator and plate, and stop or reduce “transmission” rattling.

Nothing wrong with the OEM roller weight and slide pieces. But, as you’ve expressed curiosity, IMO drop down to 26 gm Dr P sliders and while you have it apart put in new Dr P sliding pieces. You won’t regret it. And... you can sell them or reuse them in your next Silverwing.

Thanks all, I'm convinced! I replaced the sliding pieces with OEM ones when I put in the Dr P rollers but I've always had that 'transmission rattle'.

In any case I think Dr P sliders and sliding pieces are just what the Doctor ordered!...and a drop to 26g too.

Tim,are you saying that the Dr P sliding pieces are a tighter fit?

Yes, tighter fit. You may even feel that they are too tight. But remember you have 50 hp working to move the variator out so no need to fret about the tight fit of the sliding pieces.

I agree with Cosmic Jumper on this too, I put in 26gm Dr. Pulley sliders in a previous SW and was somewhat surprised about the lessened engine noise. I didn't find the sliders fitting in too tightly and installing was pleased with some definite noise reduction from the engine compartment.

Dr Pulley sliding roller weights (aka sliders) vs Dr Pulley Slide Pieces. Easily confused at times.

I recently sold my sWing to a gent with a lot of sWing-wrenching experience. He must've mentioned the Dr. P. sliders at least 3x during our meeting. Said it made a huge power difference, in his view.

YES best of both worlds faster and slightly better fuel mileage. Sliding pieces are tight new. I filed them a bit till they slid freely also sanded outer variator ramps with some 400 sandpaper till all casting grit was removed. Less vibration and smooth acceleration.

I finally ordered the 26g sliders and sliding pieces. Of all places I ended up ordering them from 'PartsForScooters.com' in St Petersburg, FL. Tom was very helpful in getting my Paypal stuff sorted and only $13.00 for shipping. Bargain!

Looking forward to fitting them