Front and Rear Grief !!! Ouch. YSS Shocks ???

Hi and hello to all on here.

I bought a 2007 silverwing in June, great bike overall, but as I suffer from Arthritis I would do with smoothing out the bumps on our small and poor roads.

It has standard shocks, but I want to upgrade to either Hagons or Ikons if possible at some point.

Anyone tried either please.

It has had Hyperpro front fork springs fitted as well with 30W oil a few years ago.

I was going to get them out and try 10w or even 7.5 w oil but not had chance yet.

Does anyone with these have any thoughts please.

Or used thinner oil etc.

The handling is great overall but as its for mainly rural poor roads its a bit too shocky if you will coming through the bars.

Many thanks SWD

Hello mate, on this forum where the majority owners are American, many seem to think you need to fit a set of HyperPro fork springs anyway for 'blasting through the twisties' and all that nonsense. You're probably the only one that has them fitted by and thinks they're rubbish.

Obviously some of us on here already know your concerns from your similar posts on the Muppets. I've no idea if you have a copy of the Boy's Own Bumper Book Of The Silver Wing, I've just looked at mine and in there it says the recommended fork fluid is Pro Honda Suspension Fluid SS-8. A quick search shows that it's 10w. So draining out that heavier 30w oil for the Honda stuff or an off the shelf 10w fork oil may be all you need to do.

By the way I still have no idea where those dodgy roads are over your neck of the woods, I've ridden over to Whitby, Robin Hood's Bay, Filey, Ravenscar etc, and they're just normal roads.

I actually think the handling is great with them overall as stated above , but on smaller poor roads, and we have plenty its pretty grim at the front road shocks coming through wise and other people have experianced that harshness with Hyperpro`s on poor surfaces.

As can be seen they were unfortunately installed with too thick oil to start with.

The roads you mention are pretty good ones compared to the small ones I`m struggling with.

No one needs to reply to my posts and asking for peoples experiances etc if it bothers them.

Friendly chat and experiances is what its all about in biking.

I met a fellow scooter rider yesterday out this way and he commented on the poor bumpy roads and he did`nt even get on to the small really bad ones at all.

I suffer from very severe and progressive Arthritis so every little bit of advice and shared experiance etc might help me keep biking for a few more years so thank you in advance anyone.

Before I start trying to change anything as it will be very painful to do, its worth seeing if just maybe what is the best option out there so I don`t need to redo things.

It may be a trip back to standard springs etc.

Thanks in advance for any advice etc.

Best SWD.

As Meldrew said try changing the fork oil to the 10w, easier than changing the shocks and it will give you  a chance to see if that will suit your needs. I don't know what transmission fluid is weight wise but some I've known have tried that, me? I stick with fork oil.

Hi thanks I am planning to change to 10w fork oil as got some good advice elsewhere.

I did ask hyperpro and they said don`t go below 15 if you can help it.

So hoping someone on here has run them with lower W oil before I do anything.

I am trying to pin down what will work before the in outs etc.

If anyone has them fitted with 10W fork oil be great to hear how they are on poor roads please in advance of all the bending etc.

Also are Hagon rear shocks or Ikons much of a step up comfort wise over stock ones please.

Thanks SWD

Before you ask any more questions, you do know your first post on here should have been introducing yourself to the members of the forum as a matter of courtesy, just like it says at the top of the Home page. Then apart from the Silver Wing owning Muppets that are already on here, the rest have some idea who you are. Just a few lines about yourself and riding experience etc, and be a bit more specific about your location rather than just the UK.

Like Meldrew I also ride in the UK and have done over fifty years, I am on my second Silver wing. I have not found it needful to change fluids in anything other than what Honda recommend. Having done forty thousand miles on my first wing and thirty thousand on my present one, I also have the standard shocks etc. I ride mainly on back country roads so where exactly are these terrible roads you encounter?. Also as Meldrew points out it is courtesy to introduce yourself before asking questions.

I can only agree with the above comments about the front end, its always going to be a bit harsh over potholes because of the smaller wheel but the fork setup seems fine as standard.
I have however changed the rear shocks to hagons, the originals are fine solo but tended to bottom out two for me on the bumpy bits.
Riding solo the hagons are harsher even on the lowest setting but are better damped and raise the back a little, which is good if you feeling a little excitable.
Hagon adjusters are at the top so its a case to crawling on the floor with a C spanner to adjust them. This is no worse than many other bikes, but the originals are far easier to adjust.
Fitting them? Oh god, that was a mission and a half. Not difficult but there is a lot of plastic to remove to get to the top bolts.
They suit me, my riding style, location and frequent pillion but they might not be for you.

Hi thank you thats great, so Hagons are not a good option for me.

Really appreciate that bit of good wisdom.

I Think its probably better I don`t post on either forum, so job done there.

I love the silverwing and I`ll just enjoy it, and do things when funds and achey bits allow.

Best Wishes.

Any pain brought to you riding SilverWing is brought on by the feet forward sitting position---your spine takes the most abuse directly....as there are no foot pegs to help support some of your body weight, no tank to grip with knees----I am on second new SilverWing, ride a fair amount----no amount of changing suspension parts is going to improve overall basic design. After 90,000 SilverWing miles......only change to suspension would be much longer travel, front and rear---which would cover re-design.

I was`nt sure whether to post on here any more, but 2 really helpful posts, thank you Steve and John, show the value of friendly chit chat etc in our shared interest.

I`ve already handily learned, as I was seriously considering some, that Hagons are not for me ( Thank you Steve ) and also Johns mention of seating/feet position, got me thinking about how I sit and the pressures etc.

After a little experimentation over the last couple of days I`ve found it best on the bumpy bits to not have my feet forward, or down flat, but actually brace them accross the footboard curve if you will, a little on both ( so there is a gap there under your feet, so on your toes and heel) and take some pressure on them, also to actually pull a little on the bars just a say too.

Its really seems to help keep the jarringss down a bit and puts you a little in anticipation of larger jolts if you will, like cattle grids and really bad bumps. And then go for a little feet up luxury on the better roads.

It also pulls your back a little forward of the back rest so that helps too, and I have that 3cm further back than the usual furthest back setting, having moved the brackets and lifted it a little thanks to some very good advice on another forum.

I ride in to the North Yorkshire Moors and Yorkshire Dales in the UK for much of my riding and the roads vary from A roads that are OKish to slightly poorer B roads, then down to the C or maybe even often more like Z roads where they are lumpy and bumpy and very poorly surfaced too.

The things is, its these quiet and a little out of the way roads that offer much less traffic, often hardly any, and the best out of the way views etc. So its very tempting to keep on buzzing down them even if your a cronky old biker with a cupboard full of cod liver oil ad various anti-inflamatories etc.

This is a great and handy forum with a wealth of experiance on these great scooters.

Just out of interest has anyone tried the Koni Dial a rides on a silverwing ?

But I think for now that different sitting/feet possition and perhaps maybe a Airhawk seat at some point will be a real help.

Its such a shame the Slverwing is not in production now.

But a 2017 registered one popped up last week on ebay here.

Does anyone know if they plan a replacement real Scooterwise. I hope so.

Best SWD. Thanks.

The north yorkshire and durham dales are my playground too swd so I understand you dilemma.
This weekend swmbo and I are in Moffat, first trip north of the border on the scooter, all the previous trips have been on a motorbike.
Having just had most pleasant ride today; the devils beef tubs, tella and megget reservoirs, mennock pass and the dalveen pass I can safely conclude there is nothing at all wrong with the standard front end setup :-)

SILVERWINGDAYS wrote:

I think for now that different sitting/feet possition and perhaps maybe a Airhawk seat at some point will be a real help.

I ride my Silver Wing in the feet forward position just as I have with all my previous maxi scooters over the last 20 years, it's so natural for me. As a long time Airhawk owner, I doubt very much if the Airhawk seat cushion will do much for your particular problem. It's not a substitute for poor suspension, or something you inflate fully like an air bed, or your favourite sex doll.

To inflate an Airhawk you just put a few breaths in it, just enough for a very thin layer of air to act as a buffer between your butt cheeks and the seat. The purpose being relieving pressure points and hot spots on your bottom caused by long hours on the seat. It's just a variation of a air cushion originally developed for wheelchair users.

I'm sorry to say this here, but for the kind of road you describe, the Silver Wing is the wrong bike. Smallish wheels and a lot of unsprung weight in the rear suspension. Not only that, but the seating position sends all the road shocks straight up the spine.

Best to replace it with a mid-weight adventure bike, in my opinion. Honda CB500x, Suzuki DL650, Kawasaki Versys 650, etc. Bigger wheels and lighter suspension components, along with more suspension travel makes a world of difference. I still miss my KLR650 sometimes.

Hi Smaug I think you are right, only thing is that getting on and off the SilverwingWing is great compared to a bike.

Last swing over bike I got on it took 2 weeks for my hip to get back to normal-ish.

Its 34 Years of biking all weathers home to roost.

But I just can`t manage with out it. That fix of the throttle etc.

I will admit my last scooter a T Max for 6 years did cope with severe bumps better than the silverwing. Especially two up it was really comfy and bumps absorbing. Just got too high for me.

I went over a particularly bad cattle grid on the silverwing I forgot to ready myself for and the jolt up my spine !!, on the Tmax it was just awkawrd but didn`t transmit like that.

Maybe a very low cruiser is the answer sort of.

But the black silverwing is really addictive and brilliant in so many ways.

So maybe some Ikons and a gel or air seat might help.

But I will say I am getting real trouble with my neck I never got on the T Max.

How on earth would you go about giving up the silverwing engine etc though.

I did think about a Gilera GP800, though very heavy. A less unsprung weight I think.

Thanks for all the help etc. SWD.

PS so would even the best air type shocks etc not do alot for the Silverwing please ? Thanks.

Just for a bit of info I called Brooke suspension in Bradford ( UK ) yesterday and talked to a very helpful chap.

I had heard they were good and he was very friendly and seemed to know his stuff.

I asked about Ikons for the silverwing and he said they found the YSS version with damping adjustment are actually better and more corrosion ressitant too.

£340 for a set plus post.

Has anyone used these YSS shocks please.

They also do a cheaper just preload one, still supposed to be pretty good.

Thanks SWD.

SILVERWINGDAYS wrote:

Just for a bit of info I called Brooke suspension in Bradford ( UK ) yesterday and talked to a very helpful chap.

I had heard they were good and he was very friendly and seemed to know his stuff.

I asked about Ikons for the silverwing and he said they found the YSS version with damping adjustment are actually better and more corrosion ressitant too.

£340 for a set plus post.

Has anyone used these YSS shocks please.

They also do a cheaper just preload one, still supposed to be pretty good.

Thanks SWD.

Like most things, if you knew someone who has/had these fitted to a Silver Wing you could make an informed decision based on their experiences wether to spend this much money.  If not, looks like you're going to be the guinea pig.

Hi Terrier, I was hoping with the large membership here someone would have had a pair of both YSS types, especially the better damped set.

I`ll keep hoping, and planning to buy some in spring 2018.

Oh Blimey, thats the first time I`ve written that actual date/year I think !!!

Best SWD

PS adjusted the original thread heading, to mention YSS shocks.

I'm still musing over what that bloke from Brooke Suspension told you about YSS shocks being more corrosion resistant than the OE ones.

I bought my Silver Wing new in November 2010 and here we are a couple of months away from the start of winter 2017, there's no rust or corrosion anywhere on the shocks, and I can adjust both of them from my preferred solo settings to passenger settings without using a C spanner. To me they're just black springed versions of the rear shocks that were OE on the up to 2012 650 Burgmans.

Apart from a couple of members fitting Hagon shocks, I can only remember posts from one member fitting a set of high end rear shocks from a US suspension company that used his Silver Wing as a test bed.

Hi, it was more corrosion resisatant than the Ikon ones we were were talking about at the time.

I can say when I got Koni Dial a rides at the time on to my VX800 in 99 ( Yee gods, how it goes ) the upgrade in comfort and handling etc was amazing.

He said they felt the YSS ones were better.

But having had a good mooch about online I have read a few posts where the the YSS ones have popped.

Getting Gel added in to the seat or just buying a gel seat pad or air one might be as good an option anyway as I`d say the Silverwing rear shocks are certainly a little better than the VX800 ones were.

If my back and neck discs ( etc ) were in less trouble it wouldn`t be an issue really.

Best SWD.

PS my middle son just got a Hagon Mono shock new for his 2009 Honda varadero 125 and very impressed with the quality of that.

YSS Shocks?? I've just bought a pair of YSS Eco Shocks, model number TE 302. The instruction manual tells me nothing about 'my' model of shock and the web isn't helping much.

I include some pics of the shocks. I am guessing that the spring loading is done using the the gold rod to turn the spring collars on a thread and the allen key to lock in place.. I gather that one turn of the shock equates to 1mm movement up or down.

Does anybody have any guidelines on the settings?,..they seem infinite. If it's a case of trial and error, I'm going to need a week off work to find the optimum setting, also, can there be a setting which copes with solo and pillion? If not, adjustment will require removal of the side panels every time I want to adjust for pillion and loaded riding....what have i done???

No idea about ideal setting. Most likely you will be able to turn collars by hand on the center stand once lock is loosened. Trial and error. Hard to reach BUT find a spot with collars to tighten locks from inside area. Good luck.

I suppose the idea is that first you measure the suspension sag on the scoot with the OEM shocks. Then you install the new YSS shocks, which as "supposed" to come pre set to OEM standards, and measure the suspension sag. From that point you fine tune the preload to your own preferences.

Any, yeah, given the task at hand, you are better off removing the side panels. At least for the initial set up. After that you can probably tweak the preload withoit removing the panels.

Please let us know how you get on with this. We all benefit from shared information. Here's a link. HTH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMDCEU98_9w

Well, here's a sight you don't see very often.....



Or this.......



and this?



This is by far the most accessible way of reaching the shocks but I didn't do it for fun. I did in order to 'have a look' and also to do this....



I forgot to take pictures but basically, have a look at everything as you go. Don't force anything plastic and just go easy, figuring out what ought to come off next. You will be removing a fair amount of screws, nuts and bolts etc. so keep a record of their locations. This first bit is about gaining access to the shocks. Below I'll cover the shocks themselves.

The last picture is the under seat bucket with access to the rear shock upper bolts. It ain't pretty but I'll make some blanking plates to keep the weather out and my stuff 'in'. It's a messy job so make a note of where all the screws, nuts and bolts came from. I actually found some mis-located screws where the previous owner had become confused. I've replaced them with the correct type.

If you have the means to create these access holes in situ you will save yourself a lot of messing about if you want to change your shocks. For me, I wanted to 'have a look' anyway and see how all this stuff fits together. It's intriguing.

One thing to watch for is the sissy bar/top box shelf fastening bolts. The two rearmost bolts thread into nuts which are 'loose', but they fall into an anchor well which keeps them in  position. When you remove the metal frame which supports the rear fairing, they could fall out as you lift it off. I include a couple of pictures:





(As we all know when you drop a crutial, engineered, irreplaceable part, it manages to hit the ground, bounce out of view...it then, unbekwnown to it's owner, rolls off the driveway, bounces off the tyre of a passing car. Then richocet's off a neighbour's garden wall and tumbles along the street until it meets the nearest surface water drain and drops into the bowels of the earth, never to be seen again!)

Another thing is the battery box. Looking into the under seat bucket, you will notice that there are two bolts visible near to the battery housing, (not the one which holds the battery cover on). You need to remove these to free it from the bucket but, there are two plastic 'grips'  holding the battery cover to the floor of the bucket which need to be lifted gently upwards and outwards with a flat screwdriver or equivalent...be careful. It does work but be very careful not to snap anything. The battery box clips fit onto the bucket quite 'firmly'. Picture below:



The shocks? I took a punt. I removed the old ones then put on the new ones, from the box.

I used one of the supplied washers on each top stub, greased it a little and then fed the new shock on. The bolts for the upper shock have a flanged washer type affair attached so no need for one of the supplied washers but a touch of grease is advised. I simply put back the bolt hand tight. I repeated the same for the other side. I torqued up the bolts later.

As for the lower bolts, I did have to use a trolley jack to support the swinging arm during this process, in order to line up the bolt holes. As for adjustment, I will have to use trial and error. When I pushed the bike off the centre stand it didn't perform it's usual, 'graceful',fall to the ground with a slight bounce. Instead it hit the ground with a thud! I slackened off the spring tension and I've found a nice balance. The road test is still to come.

BTW, I noticed a couple of clips missing from the inside of the side panels, so I put new ones on. (I had these in a small bag in the garage, I must have ordered them ages ago and forgot!). Pictures below:





I'll be glad to submit my road handling findings in due course.....

Loosebearing
Once again thank you for sharing your experience it's definatley appreciated and of great interest

I've added some pictures to my article which you might like to see. I hope this is an insight to those who haven't explored their SW...yet...

As promised here's a quick update on the new YSS Eco shocks.

I won't bore anyone by explaining the 'infinite' settings available but I measure the distance between  the threaded adjuster, (which moves downwards as you load the spring and upwards as you unload the spring) and a fixed point at the bottom of the shock.  I'll keep a handy record of the numbers for easy reference. Accessing the allen key lock and the threaded adjuster is tricky but experience will make it easier.

Riding solo I had the shocks set to the lightest setting and found the bike handles quite well in corners and bumpy roads to a point. I tried a very bumpy road at 90mph and felt like the bike was trying to throw me off, anyhow, I now know the limit.

Riding with pillion I loaded the springs by 1.5cm and once again, the bike rode well in corners at speed and on bumpy roads (...not 90mph!) Slightly better than riding solo in fact.

To summarise, the ride was smoother and I could feel the shocks soaking up the small bumps and the ride over longer humps at speed was definitely more convincing. It didn't feel like shock were going to bottom out.

We'll always feel more lumps and bumps with our small wheels but these shocks appear to be a great improvement over the old ones, which I suspect were as old as the bike itself.

The next test will be with pillion and a whole load of stuff under the seat when we go abroad in May.

Meldrew wrote:

Before you ask any more questions, you do know your first post on here should have been introducing yourself to the members of the forum as a matter of courtesy, just like it says at the top of the Home page. Then apart from the Silver Wing owning Muppets that are already on here, the rest have some idea who you are. Just a few lines about yourself and riding experience etc, and be a bit more specific about your location rather than just the UK.  

Ok Got it.

If people DO post on the "Hello" section you have a pop. If they DON'T post on the hello section you have a pop.

Seems to me if you had two ties and had to choose one you'd explode into an incontrollable rage.

I bet you are great fun to meet.

Loosebearing wrote:

As promised here's a quick update on the new YSS Eco shocks.

I won't bore anyone by explaining the 'infinite' settings available but I measure the distance between  the threaded adjuster, (which moves downwards as you load the spring and upwards as you unload the spring) and a fixed point at the bottom of the shock.  I'll keep a handy record of the numbers for easy reference. Accessing the allen key lock and the threaded adjuster is tricky but experience will make it easier.

Riding solo I had the shocks set to the lightest setting and found the bike handles quite well in corners and bumpy roads to a point. I tried a very bumpy road at 90mph and felt like the bike was trying to throw me off, anyhow, I now know the limit.

Riding with pillion I loaded the springs by 1.5cm and once again, the bike rode well in corners at speed and on bumpy roads (...not 90mph!) Slightly better than riding solo in fact.

To summarise, the ride was smoother and I could feel the shocks soaking up the small bumps and the ride over longer humps at speed was definitely more convincing. It didn't feel like shock were going to bottom out.

We'll always feel more lumps and bumps with our small wheels but these shocks appear to be a great improvement over the old ones, which I suspect were as old as the bike itself.

The next test will be with pillion and a whole load of stuff under the seat when we go abroad in May.

OK, I'm kind of new to this way of thinking but..

On a motorcycle there are set measurements you need to take before you set preload.

Especially if the spring is set for your weight.

There's a thing called "Suspension Sag". Basically what you do is measure from two fixed points on the bike, one on the bottom of the shock (I'd suggest this as you can actually see it) and a fixed point off the bike (Base of seat?).

You need to know the 3 key dimensions. Length of suspension movement. Actual dimensions with no weight on, the dimensions with the bike with the wheel on the road, and then the distance with you sat on the bike dressed as you would normally be dressed.

Then you set the spring preload. This would normally be about a third of the available suspension movement as the bike wheel has to go down into dips as well as allow for verticle deflection in the other direction it's important it has the ability to do this.

Now our 'wings don't have much in the way of front adjustability. You can buy screw in caps that have preload adjustment on them, or you could send them off to be rebuilt, but that's going to be a £500 hit.

But the rears do have a bit of adjustability..  If I can attach a link to a half decent You tube video on this I will. If I cannot, just put "Youtube Suspension Sag" into your choice of search engine and it will come up with something.

Bikes are bikes, whether they are scooters, maxi scooters or tourers such as I also own. I have done this with my two VFR's one of which has a Maxton rear shock, the other has a much more expensive unit made by Ohlins, and the sag settings being right made a vast improvement in the overall comfort.

OK, I can't post a link yet. Youtube is your friend.

Loosebearing wrote:

I did in order to 'have a look' and also to do this....

Bugger, if I'd known what you had planned I'd have advised you, that other members (in the past) have found that, by careful measuring & calculation, that it's possible to access that fixing by drilling a 20mm hole (with a hole saw) which can then be plugged with a 20mm blind grommet (as used by electricians in 'adaptable boxes)

I am thinking of buying some Bitubo shocks as 25K on almost nothing but poor back roads on my std ones has left them starting to work a little less well.

But am struggling to find any info on actual bump absorbtion even from the maker.

As mentiond I found the type 2 YSS ones with damping control ( you could not use ) are too stiff on all settings, the Factory std shocks are pretty good really overall.

The best upgrade absorbing bumps wise on mine has been the Michelin City Grips, I see the Pirelli Angel ones claim to absorb bumps, but the Rosso ones are rock hard.

Diablo`s are good too but getting hard to find.

I have disc issues back and neck so need all the help I can get, but for comfort overall I never rode a bike as good as the Silverwing, odd spinal shafting aside.

A year go I rode my sons BMW R1100RT for about 3 miles before I gave up, getting back on the SW was an absolute joy.